Lekholm DM48 Fan Club

[Wendellfiddler]

Been loving my Lekholm DM48 so here's new fanclub entry.  Posts to follow.

Doug Tanner

[Wendellfiddler]

Been playing the DM48 (referred to by in the future as the "48") a lot in the last week.  Had a hardware issue that Lekholm dealth with immediately - sent me a new slide switch by priority mail from Sweden and it got here in less than a week and solved the problem.  One of the great things about this instrument is that even with a slide switch that was less than ideal there are workarounds!  Other ways to work the slide.  Brilliant.

So, for me this thing is a major gift to my playing skills.  I can practice at night in silence!  Wow.  Just that would make it worth the reasonable cost to me.  But in addition it really works well with ipad software.  I discovered that I can play the 48 with a nice trumpet or sax sound using an ipad app called "Heavy Brass" and run both my pdf charts and iReal at the same time. iReal has it's own volume controls for piano/guitar, bass and drums so it's easy to adjust the relative volume levels between that and the 48.  I found I can easily run it through an amp - or not - use headphones - or not.

Could be the best thing about it is no valves, no slide sticking.  It just runs!

I'm interested in what other people have experienced or have been thinking about this breakthrough instrument, so here's my first post to a new fanclub.

Doug Tanner

[Gnarly He Man]

Oh Jason . . .

[SlideMeister]

Here's as good place as any to say this (I guess)

I suppose as an agenda-driven rock-headed webmaster with an attitude, I never wanna allow anything to threaten, slow the promotion (or encourage the decline) of the old, beloved "slide operated, button-assisted, bi-directional lunguiphonium. (Just that old rabid conservative in me I guess) 

You may be surprised, but I'm actually very interested in the DM-48, and would even buy one I could ever afford to, but I remember restricting the discussion on it a while back when I was having a "go 'round" with a couple members because:
1.  it was a new item
2.  it wasn't an actual (traditional) Chromatic and
3.  I felt it might actually threaten the Chromatic (and I still ain't sure about that one ) and
4.  the discussion was starting to resemble advertising (can't have that either)

Some of you may have noticed that in twenty years, I've never spelt Chromatic with a lower case "c" right?  That's just the way I am. Yeah, about the only things I can "multi-task" is being eccentric, paranoid AND stubborn about protecting "my favourite instrument."

However, since the DM-48 isn't "brand new anymore," I've changed the software to allow the brand name, as well as the model name on the forum. However, we're still gunna leave it up to my spooky discretion, as to whether it ever looks like it's getting too popular or starts to look like advertising, I'm still gunna reserve the right to quash. Howzatt?

So for now, have at it. 

A.J.Fedor - SM Admin

[Gnarly He Man]

The general reaction from the folks who have acquired one of these controllers is that it enables them to practice more.
And it's not good for much if you don't already play chrom--no one is going to buy one of these otherwise, they will use a keyboard.
So it seems to me that it would make chrom more popular--but not much!
Kids nowadays (OK Boomer) would rather use electronics.

[Bernie9]

This is good news to me, as I was one of the members that alluded to the "unmentionable gadget". As far as detracting from the chromatic, no way for several reasons.  Not only would you probably be a chromatic player already, but, in my opinion, does not replace it, but supplements it.  While singing and playing keyboard at gigs, I sometimes use my DM48 plugged into the USB port and play passages assigned to any instrument I choose.  I do this for variety and because I can play fast parts in my head that I never could play without chromatic harmonica experience, nor on the keyboard without much practice.

There are differences, also, between a harp and the DM48, some good, some not.  I find the DM48 more difficult in that you have to be right on a note or you get stuttering, whereas, my chromes are more forgiving.  You can set it to poly and get a more chordal effect, which helps.  Lastly, there is nothing like the real thing in feel, sound, and expression, but I love my DM48 for what I can add to my performance.

Thank you Age for your reconsideration.

Bernie

[Wendellfiddler]

Thanks, Age. That change appreciated. Now that I have one around I find it to be just one of my chromatics.  It's different but so is a symphony from a 260.  As has been said, it's pretty useless to you if don't have the skills to play one already.  And all of that said, It would be great if someone was to develop/invent another one with different characteristics.  The DM48 seems to be one of kind of kind right now, but perhaps others that work differently will emerge. 

doug tanner

[SlideMeister]

Okay kids, then let's see how this goes.
Age

[Bernie9]

Age
As a precautionary measure, I assume tutorial threads, or new uses, etc are okay.  What are the areas you are warning us about?

Bernie

[SlideMeister]

Yeah, "functional" stuff is fine, but nothing that resembles advertising (links to prices, where to buy and stuff like that) And mostly I'll be watching the number of posts. If it were to go "gargantuan" I'd do something, otherwise, I'm cool with it. 

[Bernie9]

Okay, thanks

[Gnarly He Man]

Yeah, "functional" stuff is fine, but nothing that resembles advertising (links to prices, where to buy and stuff like that) And mostly I'll be watching the number of posts. If it were to go "gargantuan" I'd do something, otherwise, I'm cool with it. 

Well, how about they send you one to check out?
That ought to "smooth the troubled waters".
Seems reasonable--oh Jason . . .

[SlideMeister]

Yeah right. But somehow, I'm really not anticipating that ever happening.

[lomor]

  hi folks : ) 

for me the midi harmonica is a door opened on a brand new world of sounds and possibilities . Since i got one i had to go further in the knowledge of the synthesis etc..
 i even did a 15 days course to learn a software( i won't name here for obvious reasons ) , and i still learn a lot on it ... i even discoverd a new type of "musician/neard/electronic masters /sound designers ... i didn't know about ...
very interesting stuffs and new way to make music ...
i'm also very happy with the live aspect of it , i use it mainly with the Youpi 4tet but i am thinking to use it in my regular 4tet to add some variety in my set .

glad you changed your point of view on this marvelous axe Age  .
 it 's the same as when, electric guitar appeared in the 50's i: t was not something to replace the accoustic  guitar , it was (and still) something else ...

i go back on tour tomorrow so won't have so much time to post etc...
cheers : )

laurent

[Gnarly He Man]

Glad you are working--be safe on the road.
I recently starting using electric guitar instead of acoustic in my performances for just this reason--easier to get "modern" sounds (although you can put effects on an acoustic, you get a different texture from the unvarnished acoustic that is useful in a solo setting).
I would like to explore the DM48 but have so much to do that I can't see it happening any time soon.
Happy to hear about it here however!

[Crawforde]

It is very hard to find time and space for some of us to practice/ play.
I suppose with one of these on e could put on Headphones and play and it would be silent for anyone else. Just that makes it interesting.

[Keith]

I play chrom because it is acoustic, (as are my ukes, whistles, piccolos, flutes, etc), I don't want to rely on electricity, or the need to have a computer, but, I think these instruments are add ons to a chromatic players armoury/collection, with the advantage of being able to play through headphones without disturbing other people. Would I buy one? I doubt it, it's not a chrom to me personally.

[Wendellfiddler]

I play chrom because it is acoustic, (as are my ukes, whistles, piccolos, flutes, etc), I don't want to rely on electricity, or the need to have a computer, but, I think these instruments are add ons to a chromatic players armoury/collection, with the advantage of being able to play through headphones without disturbing other people. Would I buy one? I doubt it, it's not a chrom to me personally.

I am completely down with those thoughts, Keith.  And I found myself jealous of electric guitar players who can practice quietly.  I also play guitar and while I am primarily and acoustic player I do own and use an electric guitar for the above reason - and I play it unplugged and hear enough to get by for learning purposes, etc.  Unfortunately there is no truly parallel process for the chromatic.  I got the Suzuki silencer kit and it does work, but not quite enough for 2 in the morning. 

I think people will find a variety of uses for midi harps.  Like electric violins (which I've also used) it is different than the acoustic sibling, but doesn't replace it - neither did the electric guitar.  It just made new things possible - e.g. playing guitar in bands with drums without feedback.  To me that is a parallel.  I consider it an electric chromatic harmonica, not something else.  I do believe discussion about it belongs here - within parameters that are reasonable for sure.  I wouldn't be very interested in the discussion drifting into electronic music in general - but I will point out that there have been several chromatic players at SPAH using electronics to supplement their performances - and once you hook an acoustic harmonica up to an amplification system that offers reverb and beyond you're already there - like it or not.  Again, using the guitar example - plenty of people are now using acoustic guitars connected to sound systems and altering the sound from there.  It's all the same really. 

And FWIW, it can't hurt the popularity of the instrument to have options beyond fussy valves.

doug tanner

[streetlegal]

If I had one of these I'd probably spend most my time checking out alternate tuning possibilities rather than playing with the digital effects.
I'd really only want it to play with a nice harmonica sound - maybe play around with Equalizer settings for different tones - but that would be about it.

[Gnarly He Man]

And FWIW, it can't hurt the popularity of the instrument to have options beyond fussy valves.

Amen brother.

[AimlessWanderer]

Seems to me to be a harmonica shaped MIDI controller, rather than an electric harmonica. By that I mean that electric guitars and electric orchestral strings for example, still work the same as their acoustic predecessors with correctly tuned and tensioned strings, but with the addition of a pick up to convert that to an electrical signal. This doesn't have that same premise.

I do appreciate that it gives people the scope to practice in unsociable hours, but as a MIDI controller, I think I'd prefer a keyboard format. More scope for creating different chord shapes on the fly. That's me speaking as someone who isn't dedicated to one instrument though. For someone who's main skills are harmonica based, it would make more sense and save having to learn a new format instrument. As to an electric harmonica, I would imagine that since the arrival of stainless reeds, that's a very feasible concept, needing just a small pick up at the end of each reed slot, rather than airflow sensors... or has this already been done, and I just haven't caught up to that yet?

So for me, the only potential benefit would probably be silent practice, and it's priced far too high for that to be attractive.

[Jimmy Halfnote]

 Yeah some good thinking Aimless , i would be a computer dummy to the power of ten, but strikes me this thing produces data/signals which are converted into sounds and that depends on programs/menus which require computer tech literacy, this would mean i am thinking that techniques would not be automatically transferable from a Chromatic, so new unfamiliar techniques would have to be learned on the Lekholm and again would be about the technology and adapting/experimenting/inventing ,this is time consuming and would probably be to the detriment of normal Chromatic practice.
                                     Electronic/digital wind instruments have been around for 50 years, such as Sax' and Clarinet , they don't seem to have made much inroads on the conventional instrument in that time, this Lekholm would seem to be a lot of fun and amusement for those with computer savvy, but it is a fake Chromatic harmonica , much the same as your voice would be processed the same way. These are just some thoughts right or wrong , the sound i admit can be quite impressive but however good the sound is it the sound of a Chromatic harmonica ?
                   Maybe A. J. can make up a new heading for the device, down beside the diatonic section.
                                                                                    jh.

[SlideMeister]

Jimmy sed:
"Maybe A. J. can make up a new heading for the device, down beside the diatonic section."

For now, I'm just going to "Sticky" the topic and we'll see how that goeth.

[Wendellfiddler]

Jimmy sed:
"Maybe A. J. can make up a new heading for the device, down beside the diatonic section."

For now, I'm just going to "Sticky" the topic and we'll see how that goeth.

Oh, found it.  ok. I think this is a pretty good discussion - and interesting that people who don't have one and don't seem to be interested in it have an awful lot of opinions about how it will or will not be used.  FWIW, with an ipad and garageband it's pretty much plug and play.  I spent maybe an hour putting orchestra tunings into it and have not touched that element or much of anything else of the electronics since - and don't intend to.  For me it's an electric harmonica.  I just play it and don't have to clean it. 

And again, it took me all of 15 minutes to get comfortable with it and the technique is very close to regular chromatic technique. It could be that it works well for me because I'm a center tongue player so playing on one hole alone works fine.  And as to tunings, people here have discussed that to death.  Wouldn't it be nice to be able to try bebop tuning without ruining another harmonica.  It feels about the same a CX-12.  I've also found that light breath on it works best and low and behold, at my regular gig this week I noticed my breath control had improved a little bit.  Already learning from the thing.

As to the issue of keyboard vs this thing - I can't play a keyboard.

And that it isn't comparable to an electric guitar?  Really - you don't think the technique or approach one uses to play a strat is fundamentally different than playing a D-18?  Come on.  It would take me a lot longer to do anything like what I can do on an acoustic flat top guitar on a strat and as I said - 15 minutes to play the DM48 well enough and do just about everything I can do on a Sirius 56.

And whether it is the sound of chromatic harmonica probably depends a lot on the player.  I don't think I sound all that much different on it.  I can easily manipulate the sound of a Suzuki 56 to sound very close to the same using either effects on my amp or the other way using a good harmonica synth sound. 

I just encourage the nay sayers to try it sometime.  It's not the evil you think anymore than the electric guitar is/was.  And frankly I am not a rock and roll fan.  You can have the strats - I generally dont' like them.  But I wouldn't argue that isn't a guitar.

I don't mean to be argumentative - just that I think a lot of people would use it exactly as I have so far because most of us it seems are acoustic chromatic players and would likely have similar uses for it.  For those who are interested in different tunings it would seem to be a huge gift.  I'm not one of those but it really seems like it would be good way to try out tunings before building solid reed models.  As to cost - I have at least twenty chromatics and several  - no,  more than several  - probably six or seven that could cost more than this one did. 

Doug Tanner

[Wendellfiddler]

If I had one of these I'd probably spend most my time checking out alternate tuning possibilities rather than playing with the digital effects.
I'd really only want it to play with a nice harmonica sound - maybe play around with Equalizer settings for different tones - but that would be about it.

That's pretty much what I do. Set it and forget it.  So far I find a decent sax sound works best and I just leave it there. Makes sense - both reed instruments.  I like what I've heard from others using trumpet, but for me I haven't found that as satisfying - fits less with my harmonica style.

doug t

[AimlessWanderer]

Wendellfiddler, as you seem to have taken my post and taken it apart, I will reply
(Don't worry, I'm not taking your post personally)

I think this is a pretty good discussion - and interesting that people who don't have one and don't seem to be interested in it have an awful lot of opinions about how it will or will not be used. 

Correct. As that's a great way to determine if you'd be interested in it or not Most people don't buy stuff before deciding if they want it 

Wouldn't it be nice to be able to try bebop tuning without ruining another harmonica.

Possibly - but not at that price. Not even close. If however you wanted one instrument that you could use as a bass, tremolo, bebop, and ... and ... and ... then that cost/benefit changes considerably. In fact for someone who wants occasional use of certain types of instrument, without sufficient need to actually buy them all, this might be an ideal gap filler.

I don't - so that's a moot point for me personally

And that it isn't comparable to an electric guitar?

No, and I'll clarify that.

I saw a video yesterday, of a DIGITAL guitar. It's played kind of the same way as a guitar, but again it's a MIDI controller, rather than an acoustically based instrument with electrical output. The strings aren't tensioned, and if turned off, would sound nothing like a guitar. It's essentially "buttons" (albeit in the format of strings) triggering a sampled sound to be played from a synthesizer. THAT would be a better analogy for this DM48.

An electric guitar captures the actual vibrations made by the instrument, and converts that to a signal. Those vibrations never exist to begin with on this Lekholm instrument. I'm not saying that makes it evil, fraudulent, or not a valid instrument in it's own right. I'm just saying it's different, and more like that digital guitar than an electric guitar. 

I just encourage the nay sayers to try it sometime.

I don't TRY things at that price. I either commit to it, or steer clear. If a £40 version comes out, then I might consider it.

I don't mean to be argumentative - just that I think a lot of people would use it exactly as I have so far because most of us it seems are acoustic chromatic players and would likely have similar uses for it.

I'm not for one moment suggesting everyone should write this off as a waste of money. I'm just putting it in context as a MIDI controller rather than "electric harmonica", and saying that for me personally, it's a solution to problems I don't have. If others think it offers them more value, I have no interest in discouraging them. If you see it for what it is, and that has appeal to you, or looks like it will improve your musical capabilities and enjoyment - get stuck in.

[AimlessWanderer]

Electronic/digital wind instruments have been around for 50 years, such as Sax' and Clarinet ,

Exactly what it reminded me of, stuff like this Roland Aerophone



Modelled on a specific type of instrument, but not an electronic version of it. I've no doubt great music can be had from it, but I chose to buy a "real" clarinet, for the looks, feel. challenges, and authenticity of the traditional instrument.

Conversely, I do also own an electric guitar and tabletop electronic drum pad thingy, so I'm not a complete luddite 

[Wendellfiddler]

So, I just spent about four hours working on skylark (in F) while my wife was watching tv right across the room from me.

May not be worth it to everyone, but this, in my house, is revolutionary.

doug tanner

[Wendellfiddler]

Really, all I can tell you since I play the guitar and I'm somewhat aware of those Roland midi saxophones is that the feel of the DM48, the size, the response and in some ways even the sound if you set up to be so is much more like playing a reeded harmonica than any of the above. 

Anyone who plays half decent can pick it up and play it right away if they use an ipad.  That said, my experience using software for windows - the one that seems to be the most common is "reason"  - is not as user friendly and does require digging into the software.  I've pretty much given up on that because the ipad with garageband and an app called Heavy Brass is so easy to use and responds like a normal harp. 

But of course, it does cost a relatively large amount of money when a decent harp like a cabaret is available for not much more than $100.  For me, learning Skylark in three of four hours in my living room in the evening has already given me my money's worth.


But that's just me.  But then I think of myself as a musician who happens to play the chromatic harmonica, not a "harmonica player" - not that there's anything wrong with that. 

doug t

[AimlessWanderer]

I'm glad it's working out so well for you, Doug. If it gets popular, maybe there'll be more accessibly priced versions in future