Author Topic: Modern music focuses on rhythm  (Read 1334 times)

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Offline beads

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Modern music focuses on rhythm
« on: May 07, 2023, 03:03:02 PM »
Finally there is a university study to back it up. We are not just cranky old farts who imagine the beat is at the forefront and the vocals are buried. It is real and it is intentional.
https://www.npr.org/2023/05/05/1174381307/beck-music-adele-beyonce-volume-pop-indie-alternative-study
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Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2023, 03:41:23 PM »
And where does this leave the chromatic harmonica, so well suited to key changes?
Here’s a hint, what was the last Grammy winning song with chromatic harmonica?

That's What Friends Are For was 1986.

Grégoire Maret got the Grammy in 2005 for his work with Pat Metheny, that was 18 years ago.

Offline Age

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2023, 04:36:38 PM »
I think it's a pretty good idea; it'll cause the listener(s) to pay more attention to the "whole thing." There's a lotta talent out there that we never really get to appreciate cuz they go more or less, "unshowcased," cuz they always get buried and even minimized like audio "wallpaper." This way, the lead is just gunna hafta be that much better and and maybe even (in effect) compete in order to showcase themselves while giving the actual "musicians" their due. if the background sux, then crank up the lead, otherwise, let's hear the "music." This way, "music" (all of it) will collectively, have the bar raised. (at least, thet's hayw ouy see's it.) ;D ;D
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Offline Grizzly

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2023, 05:04:55 PM »
And where does this leave the chromatic harmonica, so well suited to key changes?
Here’s a hint, what was the last Grammy winning song with chromatic harmonica?

That's What Friends Are For was 1986.

Grégoire Maret got the Grammy in 2005 for his work with Pat Metheny, that was 18 years ago.

1986: Stevie Wonder. Find it on YouTube.

Dionne Warwick, Elton John, Gladys Knight, Stevie. I first heard it in an ad from Pass It On. Chokes me up every time.

Tom
« Last Edit: May 07, 2023, 05:18:22 PM by Grizzly »
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Offline Gene Oh

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2023, 05:35:59 PM »
This thread reminds me of what Tom, a seasoned musician, commented when he heard my playing a tune called "La Novia" on our YoutubeMeister thread.

Tom said: "Oh, my! The reverb does you no favors. It's hard to tell if the beats line up. As far as sounding like Tony Dallara, it sounds pretty close. Tom"
I responded to Tom's comment saying that I will try to minimize the reverb next time so the backing track may be heard more loudly and clearly.
But I don't know to what level I will have to adjust the volume of the backing track.

It seems that the backing track is as important as the melody played.
So, is it correct that I need to set the volume including the reverb at about the ratio of 50-50 between the backing track and the melody?
Cheers,
Gene

Offline brorat

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2023, 06:43:39 PM »
This is only my opinion, Gene.
I don’t think there’s a magic number. It’s a very subjective thing. For me, I want to hear the “whole song”. The background accompaniment is a critical part of the song, but without being able to clearly hear the melody, it’s not “whole”.
I suggest you do “tests” prior to making a recording. Try different levels of volume, different settings for reverb and other features. There are people who make a great living “mixing” songs!  If you do a test recording or two, tweaking the mix, pick the one that sounds the way you want it to sound, then upload the song.
As I said, I see it as both subjective and personal. To paraphrase someone famous, “I’m not a record producer, but I know a good mix when I hear it!”
“Just here to harp on chromatics!”

Offline John Broecker

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2023, 06:57:11 PM »
In European and American music,
to generalize:

There are 2 basic kinds of music,
Listening music and dancing music.

In the 20th century European and
American music, the most popular
music was dance music.

In dance music:

The rhythm sets the pulse and tempo;
the backing track (accompaniment, harmony)
sets the mood;
the melody delivers the story.

In listening music:

The rhythm is usually changing;
There is not always a backing track;
The melody can be abstract.

Other cultures mostly favor dance music, but
African music favors complex rhythms; with
simple melodies; and polymetric textures as
backing tracks, or no backing tracks.

Music seems to change priorities about every
generation. Each world culture has it's own
unique music.

Best Regards, Stay Musical

JB
« Last Edit: May 08, 2023, 08:04:05 AM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

Offline Age

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2023, 08:39:43 PM »
I've been experimenting a lot with this myself. Lately when I play alone (without a backing track) while listening with headphones, I add just a bit more reverb than I want, then when I play it with a backing track, I back the reverb off till it seems to disappear. Now I leave it at that level and play again without a backing track and hear that it's back. What that means to me is that now I'm in the neighborhood. Now, without touching the reverb level, I go back to the mix with the backing track and I can no longer hear the reverb, but I know it's there cuz I just heard it. The backup music actually absorbs and/or shadows my reverb on my harmonica. Thats when I increase the reverb again just a hair. Even if I don't hear it, I know I just heard it when I played without the backup track, a minute ago so I'm satisfied. I hear a lotta players and vocalists (especially lately) that are dry as sawdust. I suppose that's what's IN nowadays, but it's not for me.  Drenched in reverb and other effects? Not so much, but just "damp" is what gets it for me. To each his own, I guess. :P

Age
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Offline wolfman

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2023, 09:48:34 PM »
  ...and the beat goes on. :)

Offline Keith

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2023, 05:05:17 AM »
If it's a song, I want to hear the words; if it's instrumental I want to hear the whole tune; just my opinion, of course. ;)

Offline wolfman

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2023, 11:58:29 AM »
 I'm with you on that Keith.

 Roman

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2023, 12:50:23 PM »
“All we need is a drummer, for people who only need a beat.”
“Dance to the Music”, Sly and the Family Stone, released in’68.
Lotta talent there.

Offline Age

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2023, 01:42:08 PM »
Yep! Definitely "Different Strokes" ;D
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Offline Ed McCullough

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2023, 12:48:55 AM »
I used to like the music in the Saturday radio program "Prairie Home Companion" when Garrison Keillor hosted it.
Then he turned the program over to the mandolin player Chris Thiele. I do not remember the name of the new program, but I did not like the music. I mentally called the new music "drum music". The new music did not feature melodies. Just drums and maybe some form of guitars. I do not care for "drum music".
« Last Edit: May 10, 2023, 12:59:01 AM by Ed McCullough »

Offline Age

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2023, 09:41:18 AM »
"Rap" is drum stuff that I refuse to even associate with the word "music."
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Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2023, 10:38:14 AM »
I used to like the music in the Saturday radio program "Prairie Home Companion" when Garrison Keillor hosted it.
Then he turned the program over to the mandolin player Chris Thiele. I do not remember the name of the new program, but I did not like the music. I mentally called the new music "drum music". The new music did not feature melodies. Just drums and maybe some form of guitars. I do not care for "drum music".
I have seen Chris Thiele a couple of times, nothing deficient in his musicianship.

The music of PHC definitely changed after he got the gig.  He’s pretty young!

Here’s a clip, drummer doesn’t come in until almost the 4 minute mark.

https://youtu.be/GdBYndEekqs

They changed the name of the program after a little while, and it continued for a few seasons but was ultimately dropped.
Chris received a MacArthur Grant a few years back, he doesn’t need the money.

Offline Ed McCullough

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2023, 12:06:47 PM »
The music that Chris Thiele played himself was pretty good, but I didn't care a rat's kneecap for most of the guest musicians that he brought onto the program. His guest musicians were the ones who played the "drum music".

Offline John Broecker

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2023, 07:42:53 PM »
Of the three basic and equal parts in music,
(melody, harmony, rhythm), rhythm is the
most abstract.

It's understandable that many music lovers
don't like music that is only drumming, or
drumming and poetry. Rhythm is the least
understood among the three parts of music.

The old song, Fever, as sung by Rosemary Clooney (?),
uses snare drum with brushes, a stand-up acoustic
bass, and vocal melodies. No other instruments,
if I remember correctly. It was a risky decision
to record it that way, but it was a big hit at that
time (early-middle 1950s?).

Rap music is drumming and recited poetry. No
melodies, no harmonies. Like beatnik coffee houses.

Best Regards, Stay Healthy

John D. Rockabilly (the "D" is for "Drums")
« Last Edit: May 11, 2023, 07:26:33 AM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2023, 09:57:49 PM »


The old song, Fever, as sung by Mary Clooney (?),
uses snare drum with brushes, and vocal melodies.


Best Regards, Stay Healthy

John D. Rockabilly (the "D" is for "Drums")

Peggy Lee, IIRC.

Offline Ed McCullough

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2023, 11:39:22 PM »
In the recording of Fever made by Peggy Lee, the drums are used very tastefully and do not bury the melody. You absolutely know what the melody is and can easily hear it.
The guest musical groups that Chris Thiele brought onto his program were not so interested in leading the listener to hearing melodies. In my ear, the percussion instruments and guitars often had a strong component of bothersome noise. They left me yearning for real music with melodies.

Offline Age

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2023, 11:54:26 PM »
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Offline Ed McCullough

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2023, 12:01:38 AM »
The drummer and Sammy Davis Jr worked together very well. They beat the snot out of the drum noise and guitar noise of the guest groups on Chris Thiele's program.

Offline John Broecker

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Re: Modern music focuses on rhythm
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2023, 07:29:36 AM »
Peggy Lee is correct. My memory is crumbled,
in the paper waste basket. Her sexy recording
was first made in 1958.

British comedian Benny Hill performed it on his show
in 1959(?), with a sexy singer, and Benny on bongos.

JB
« Last Edit: May 11, 2023, 07:44:44 AM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.