Author Topic: Diatonic Review  (Read 35174 times)

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-krizem

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Diatonic Review
« on: July 02, 2008, 07:55:35 PM »
Can we please get a diatonic review section also in this forum........ I know Dave Payne could review a ton of Seydel stuff ;) ;) Hint hint ;D
We need to work on a format maybe so we can all fill in the pros and cons playability and build quality etc..... this would be cool there is already a Chromatic review section so why no diatonic review section as well ;D

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2008, 11:17:10 PM »
I try to avoid that, cause unlike Grizz, I AM affiliated with an online dealer, cause I am one. But I could do it, I'll refer to Age for a judgement call there, also Grizz, since he is pure as wind-driven-snow, ;) his neutrality would be appreciated. I could do it and just maybe not compare them with other brands. 

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2008, 11:37:23 PM »
Sure,
Send me the diatonics and I'll be glad review them (and of course keep'em too ;D)

Seriously, send me your reviews (preferrably with a good picture of the thing) and we'll put up a page, not on the main site, but in the gallery.

(everyone but Dave, that is  :))

Offline smojoe

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2008, 01:50:01 AM »
I'm not in favor of it. That's why I never went into any more detail on the 'chromatic' forum. All you're going to get is people's personal opinions. Some of those people are players and some are owners. Example: I say that a 12 hole chromo is more than most players can master and in fact, NO one has mastered. Someone else says that ONLY a 64 will do. (which is a valid argument...AS presented) Then someone says that the CX-12 is the greatest thing since Dutch tulips, and I say that the slide clicks like the wheels of the Orient Express as it traverses the notoriously rough Yugoslavian train tracks. Then I say that I have found the perfect diatonic for ME and it's the spl-20. Then someone else says a Bushmaster, A Suzie promaster or yada yada will clean any other harp off the map. But the writer doesn't go for spot on bent notes where the bend is already IN when the reed is hit. OR, there's the famous debachle where only a hot-rodded custom diatonic will do, because.......Then, when I write, I forget to explain that while other harps may BE better than the spl-20, I am either too lazy to try one, have enough harps to keep me busy for a while (the truth) or I am opposed to buying harps from certain countries because.......

It all comes down to this. I have read reviews on Coast to Coast's site, and in some cases, I knew the writers and in other cases, I didn't. So who is to judge. 

Opps, I just broke my '666 messages' status.

smo-joe

Offline Grizzly

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2008, 02:01:05 AM »
8<
Opps, I just broke my '666 messages' status.

smo-joe
You li'l debbil, you

I agree with Joe. We have a modest presence among diatonic players here. As such, it's a valid subset of SlideMeister. But we run the risk of a situation becoming the tail wagging the dog. Opening it up to reviews might set us off in a direction we don't want to go.

Tom
working on my second 10,000!

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2008, 01:02:56 PM »
I'm not in favor of it. That's why I never went into any more detail on the 'chromatic' forum. All you're going to get is people's personal opinions. Some of those people are players and some are owners. Example: I say that a 12 hole chromo is more than most players can master and in fact, NO one has mastered. Someone else says that ONLY a 64 will do. (which is a valid argument...AS presented) Then someone says that the CX-12 is the greatest thing since Dutch tulips, and I say that the slide clicks like the wheels of the Orient Express as it traverses the notoriously rough Yugoslavian train tracks



Joe, you couldn't be more wrong.
The orient express hasn't run through Yugoslavia for years, plus the part of Yugoslavia it went through would now be Croatia, I think. It may have even still gone to Instanbul back in the days when you rode it. When I rode it back in 1997, the Orient Express was from Budapest to Paris and I rode it from Budapest to Paris, just to say I rode it. When I got tired of the beer and sausages in Salzburg, I'd hop on it and go to Munich for the Munich sausages and beer, which are just like the ones in Salzburg, except you were in Bavaria when you ate the sausages and drank the beer.
I've heard that now it only goes from Paris to Strasbourg, which is crap... doesn't even leave France now.

On the other stuff, the non-orient express stuff, you couldn't be more right. Just funnin' on the Orient Express ;)

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2008, 01:35:06 PM »
First of all, I'm no suck harper; in fact, I think it's an inferior instrument, and I'm obviously not threatened by them either.  (at least I hope you guys know that)

My offer to have some diatonic reviews in the gallery does not indicate a swing in the focus of this group, but rather to give the ten hole players in the group something to do. I've always said, if the focus of this group were ever to even begin to lean away from rabid Chromaticism, I'd pull the plug on all the diatinic stuff.  So, I don't see any harm in it, but I'll you guys decide. Somebody run a poll, and I'll go with the results.

Don't worry, I won't feel bad if it dies, (just means less work for me to do  ;D)

age

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #7 on: July 03, 2008, 01:40:50 PM »
If you don't throw them some kind of bone, there is little reason for them to hang around and develop interest in chromatics.

Offline smojoe

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2008, 03:15:51 PM »
Waddaya mean the diatonic is an inferior instrument? A lot of my heros play them.    :)

smo-joe

simon

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2008, 04:53:10 PM »
Let the diatonic take up residence. The neighborhood won't
be adversely affected.

bill d simon

rgn39

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2008, 05:01:15 PM »
I love to listen to what some people can do with a naked ten holer but this is SlideMeister after all................

Offline John Broecker

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2008, 07:28:14 PM »
Hello, Diatronics.

I play all types of harmonicas except the antique Hohner Harmonetta, and we all get along nicely.

A Diatonic Review might be useful for new harmonica players who haven't established their personal preferences yet, and who are looking for product comparisons and appraisals from experienced diatonic players.

For a truly unbiased review, the diatonic reviews should be made only by people not affiliated in any way with any harmonica manufacturer, harmonica customizer, harmonica distributor or harmonica sales personnel, or professional harmonica players with manufacturer endorsement contracts.

That's hopefully what is done with the chromatic reviews.

Let's go for it.

John Broecker
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2008, 08:42:52 PM »
If something happened where Chromatics were made illegal or somethin' I'm not sure if play diatonics or quit and go back to the guitar, maybe try the sax. This late in life, I might just stick with the radio. Like I say, I play diatonics as good (or as bad -it's hard to tell) as the average harmonica convention attendee, and of course better than most of the youtube entries. (Ya-Hiey! Tooowey!) If I couldn't at least do a decen't P.T.Gazell impersonation, I don't think I'd be satisfied with suck harps.

age
« Last Edit: July 04, 2008, 10:22:34 PM by A.J.Fedor »

-krizem

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2008, 07:20:50 AM »
Well this subject seemed to rapidly gather a bit of interest  ;D It is just a thought though, I also do think that the diatonic and chromatic are both in different worlds and in know way inferior ...just look at what Jason Ricci can do on the diatonic he rocks.
Why I am learning the chromatic my diatonic is still number 1 for me...I have played a number of diatonics and would gladly point someone in the direction of a good one  ;D Now I just have to find a decent chromatic book...I have my eye on one already, it covers diatonic too very large 2 cd book with about 250pages or so.....Having a blast on both diatonic and chromatic

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #14 on: July 04, 2008, 09:15:18 AM »
First of all, I'm no suck harper; in fact, I think it's an inferior instrument, and I'm obviously not threatened by them either.  (at least I hope you guys know that)

Geez Age, haven't we been fighting this battle for a 150 years? The rest of the world puts the chromatic in the toy category, same as they do the diatonic. What I see there is you standing with those folks saying "but my harmonica is different somehow."
Could be wrong, but that's what I see.

« Last Edit: July 04, 2008, 01:53:22 PM by ElkRiverHarmonicas »

rgn39

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #15 on: July 04, 2008, 11:47:33 AM »
What do you mean Dave? I thought the 270 was pretty highly regarded. Most advertisements tout it as THE harmonica.

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #16 on: July 04, 2008, 01:52:27 PM »
I went back and changed that post to clarify, I didn't mean the 270 specifically, I meant the chromatic. General people lump all harmonicas together as toys, or, at best, inferior instruments. I play a few 270s myself.

Didn't chromatic players have trouble getting into the musician's union years ago? That's the cultural dynamic I'm talking about.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2008, 01:54:49 PM by ElkRiverHarmonicas »

rgn39

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #17 on: July 04, 2008, 03:50:37 PM »
Youre right about one thing, the harmonica seems to be held in low regard by a lot of people when it comes to serious music. As I stated in another post, what are your chances of making a living playing the harmonica no matter how good you are?

Offline smojoe

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #18 on: July 04, 2008, 04:35:13 PM »
I think you guys are missing something. You don't understand why the harmonica is viewed as a toy. BUT...but but but , you guys (and girls too) ARE harmonica players. The rest of the world has other things on their minds. What you can do is get out there and play. But you have to play GOOD, otherwise you will perpetuate the myth that harmonicas are silly toys.

smo-joe

pmelissakis

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #19 on: July 04, 2008, 04:44:00 PM »
Here is my revue of diatonics,

They are;
1. generally cheaper and smaller than chromatics,
2. and smaller with fewer notes than chromatics.

I realize that there are a lot of people out there that will
disagree with me.

Pete

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #20 on: July 04, 2008, 10:09:46 PM »
As I said, I play diatonics, cuz I learned on diatonics. Once finding the Chromatic however, I liked them so much better that, in comparison, I don't even like diatonics.

Like paddling around in a leaky canoe with holes and a broken oar before knowing that wasn't normal, then being given a new cabin cruiser. Seriously, how much use would you expect me to have for that old canoe after getting the cabin cruiser? I'm really not trying to hurt anyone's feelings (or trying NOT to hurt anyone's feelings) just stating my opinion here, and again: I think (that means, this is what I think) for me, diatonics are inferior and nothing will ever change that. Like if I like blue better than red. No amount of pressure would even change that opinion. Why do you think I went through the trouble to start SlideMeister?


« Last Edit: July 06, 2008, 04:05:27 PM by A.J.Fedor »

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #21 on: July 04, 2008, 10:30:14 PM »
Speaking of PT Gazell, the boy just joined us here at SlideMeister. This guy's my diatonic hero. He not only plays "chromatically" but he plays a lot of the same kind of music Chromatic players play, instead of all the "cookie cutter blues" the rest of them play and as such has earned ALL my respect. PT is always one of the highlights of any harmonica convention for me. If I could play diatonic like this guy, man, all bets would be off and I wouldn't know how to act!  ;D

Age
« Last Edit: July 04, 2008, 10:32:55 PM by A.J.Fedor »

Offline John Broecker

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2008, 08:32:06 AM »
Hello, A.J. and others.

Here are a few ideas to consider when talking about diatonics versus chromatics, or harmonicas in general. The replies are my opinions.

A.J. said that if chromatic harmonicas were made illegal, he wasn't sure if he'd play diatonics, or quit (harmonica playing), and go back to the guitar, or try a sax.

It's my opinion that if chromatic harmonicas were made illegal, many harmonica players and many non-harmonica players would want one, and there would be a huge black market for chromatic harmonicas. There is no reason to ban or make illegal any musical instrument.

A.J. also said that a diatonic is "like paddling around in a leaky canoe with holes and a broken oar, and then being given a new cabin cruiser."

Using that analogy, which harmonica (diatonic or chromatic) has the most holes? The chromatic. Which harmonica is the most "leaky?" The chromatic. Which harmonica has the broken oar? The chromatic (slider).

The chromatic is the leaky boat with holes and the broken oar, and the diatonic is a speed boat, with fewer holes, fewer leaks and no paddle, in my opinion.

Another Slider stated that harmonicas in general are seen as toys, compared to other musical instruments. They are seen as toys by some, but not by all. Some consider harmonicas toys, some consider them tools, and some don't think about harmonicas at all.

In my opinion, harmonicas in general are as valid a musical instrument as any other musical instrument, and diatonics are as vailid as chromatics. Each musical instrument is as valid as another. There is a place and a use for every musical instrument and voice.

It's the use of the harmonica, not it's construction or sound, that should determine it's acceptability or rejection as a tool or a toy. Since there are so many professional harmonica players, to call harmonicas only a toy, in my opinion, is a mistake.

Harmonicas are toys, for me.  I get great satisfaction just from playing them. Harmonicas don't make money for me, except in teaching, so, for me, they are toys. And tools.

John Broecker
« Last Edit: July 05, 2008, 08:37:07 AM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2008, 09:29:50 AM »
As I said, I play diatonics, cuz I learned on diatonics. Once finding the Chromatic however, I liked them so much better that, in comparison, I don't even like diatonics.

Like paddling around in a leaky canoe with holes and a broken oar before knowing that wasn't normal, then being given a new cabin cruiser. Seriously, how much use would expect me to have for that old canoe after getting the cabin cruiser? I'm really not trying to hurt anyone's feelings (or trying NOT to hurt anyone's feelings) just stating my opinion here, and again: I think (that means, this is what I think) for me, diatonics are inferior and nothing will ever change that. Like if I like blue better than red. No amount of pressure would even change that opinion. Why do you think I went through the trouble to start SlideMeister?




So, is the color red inferior?

dddeon

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #24 on: July 05, 2008, 09:40:10 AM »
Here here John!

I like your take on the subject.

Quote:
"In my opinion, harmonicas in general are as valid a musical instrument as any other musical instrument, and diatonics are as vailid as chromatics. Each musical instrument is as valid as another. There is a place and a use for every musical instrument and voice.

It's the use of the harmonica, not it's construction or sound, that should determine it's acceptability or rejection as a tool or a toy. Since there are so many professional harmonica players, to call harmonicas only a toy, in my opinion, is a mistake.

Harmonicas are toys, for me.  I get great satisfaction just from playing them."
« Last Edit: July 07, 2008, 04:15:18 PM by dddeon »

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #25 on: July 05, 2008, 12:55:11 PM »
i'm too busy today

ElkRiverHarmonicas

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #26 on: July 05, 2008, 03:02:09 PM »
No offense meant, A.J.

Offline smojoe

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #27 on: July 05, 2008, 05:27:35 PM »
You broke my heart AGE

joey boo-hoo

Offline SlideMeister

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #28 on: July 05, 2008, 07:41:29 PM »
Broecher wrote:

A.J. said that if chromatic harmonicas were made illegal, he wasn't sure if he'd play diatonics, or quit (harmonica playing), and go back to the guitar, or try a sax.

Yep! I distinctly remember saying that!

John continues:
It's my opinion that if chromatic harmonicas were made illegal, many harmonica players and many non-harmonica players would want one, and there would be a huge black market for chromatic harmonicas. There is no reason to ban or make illegal any musical instrument.


Really? :)


John continues:
A.J. also said that a diatonic is "like paddling around in a leaky canoe with holes and a broken oar, and then being given a new cabin cruiser."


The "boat holes" in my analogy had as much to do with harmonicas as did the oar; NOTHING!  Here change it to this:
Like a guy who lived on plain boiled rice for twenty-five years before discovering butter and salt! (see? no holes to interpret as leaks or oars to interpret for slides - JUST WHAT I LIKE OR DON'T LIKE.)


John continues:
Another Slider stated that harmonicas in general are seen as toys, compared to other musical instruments. They are seen as toys by some, but not by all. Some consider harmonicas toys, some consider them tools, and some don't think about harmonicas at all. In my opinion, harmonicas in general are as valid a musical instrument as any other musical instrument, and diatonics are as valid as chromatics. Each musical instrument is as valid as another. There is a place and a use for every musical instrument and voice.


Thanx for sharing, But what's that have to do with me personally preferring Chromatics over diatonics? And what in the world were you rattling about there bro? Certainly not about anything I said.  :)

Sounds like you better start a new thread. 

Gimme a break here Johnny! :)

age
« Last Edit: July 05, 2008, 07:46:23 PM by A.J.Fedor »

Offline Grizzly

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Re: Diatonic Review
« Reply #29 on: July 05, 2008, 09:38:51 PM »
You're shouting, Age. Oh, well, it gets the point across; sometimes it's necessary.

There must have been some instruments that have been outlawed through the ages (small a).

But not harmonica. 

I'm thinking violin (the devil's instrument), bagpipe (really, an instrument of war). Some churches didn't allow musical instruments. The Taliban probably didn't like them much either. (They didn't like a lot of things.)

There never did develop a black market for fiddles or bagpipes.

Tom

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