Author Topic: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica  (Read 386 times)

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Offline Gnarly He Man

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Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« on: January 01, 2025, 01:14:45 PM »
As I stated on another thread, it’s easy to play the diatonic harmonica, as long as you don’t try to get it to do something it doesn’t want to do.
And it was designed to be easy to play, in the good old Tyrolean fashion. Oomp pah …
But a lot of people use the diatonic harmonica to play in what’s called second position , the inhale mode.
And that’s where the fun is… Microtones.
More later.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2025, 11:30:41 AM by Gnarly He Man »

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing, the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2025, 01:32:10 PM »
Blow three and draw two are the same note!
Large, robust sounding bends are achievable on these two holes.
Holes one and four also have missing notes hidden in the draw bends.
Granted, important notes are missing from the bent and unbent notes, including Fa and La on the bottom and Ti on the top. Modern players use extended techniques to try to turn the diatonic into a chromatic instrument with mixed results.
Still, you can have a lot of fun and produce good sounding music on the diatonic harmonica. Not just Blues, ask Bob Dylan.
These instruments are so very portable, every child deserves one.

Offline Age

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing, the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2025, 03:51:51 PM »
I've always toyed around with doing the P.C.Gazelle setup on my suck-harps :)
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Offline Lockjaw Larry

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing, the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2025, 07:47:13 PM »
A few years ago I made my own windsavers and installed in several diatonics like PT does, referred to as half valving.  I prefer these to non-valved for most of my playing.  Highly recommend giving them a try, you may become a believer too.  Several YouTube videos focus on half-valving if you’re interested.
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Offline Age

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing, the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2025, 09:17:11 PM »
Yeah, and you play'em mostly in first position, right?
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Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2025, 11:35:51 AM »
Second position becomes Major if you tune 5 draw up a half step.
Smokey Joe is a pioneer in this tuning, Charlie McCoy makes good use of it too.
Commonly known as Country tuning, for me, it’s just the start of a universe of harmonic possibilities.
Most manufacturers sell Country tuned diatonic harmonicas, sometimes draw 9 is tuned to the same note, “double Country”.

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2025, 12:05:15 PM »
Never tried "country." Mayhaps I grab an old, beat up suck-harp and my little file and give it a try. :)
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Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2025, 06:51:32 PM »
Never tried "country." Mayhaps I grab an old, beat up suck-harp and my little file and give it a try. :)
All the draw bends suddenly make sense!

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2025, 10:36:39 PM »
Kewl!
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Offline smojoe

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2025, 10:54:44 PM »
You don't really need valves on ALL your diatonic reeds. As long as you can bend in what you want when you want. I only need ONE valve. I bend-in the rest. I forget but I seem to recall that I can get at least 38 tones from a 10 hole/20 reed diatonic. And yes, I sometimes tune the 9 draw too.
Most all of my various performances (very few of which have been recorded), include both diatonic and chromatic tunes. Some tunes feature both.

The only people whom have ever had the interest to video me at harmonica functions are 1. Danny G., 2. Scotty, 3. Mama Cass. But since my 81 yr schedule expired 9/19/23, there will be no more.

Next Stop Willoughby

Offline Age

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2025, 11:44:39 PM »
Naah! We need ya! 8)

No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe! No retirement for Smokey Joe!
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Offline Lockjaw Larry

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2025, 06:23:32 AM »
I met mister entertainer Smo Joe in Williamsburg Harmonicafest in 2011 ( or 2912?).  He put on a great performance and private discussions afterwards.  I really enjoyed his presence and have on occasion texted with him.  What a great man!
I remember after his performance he told me he hoped he wasn’t boring.  WHAT???  I assured him that wasn’t.  How humble!  I wish I could have videoed that performance and uploaded to YouTube.  However, he can be found playing his heart out on YouTube at another festival if anyone here wants to see him in action.  https://youtu.be/dDBwh9_dAzA?si=ivO-E1fYhN3HQD2o Is one if the link works.  If not just search YouTube.

Play it again Smo.  Please.
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Offline servus

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2025, 07:18:38 AM »
Just listened to Smojoe's "Summertime". Splendidissimo! Wow!
Servus

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2025, 09:16:50 AM »
Well, the password is, "inspiration".
I respect Joe's decision, at some point we all have to draw the line.
Joe's my buddy. Let him be Joey.

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2025, 09:39:22 AM »
No retirement for Smokey Joe!
Anagram=Or joky memories often enter

Fun with letters

 :P

Offline smojoe

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2025, 05:13:34 PM »
I appreciate your writings Larry, I really do. I enjoyed you and crazy Bob immensely. In fact I always enjoyed the Cardinal state reunions.
Servus. Thank you so much. I tried?
Gnarley. What can I say 'coomp'. You da man.

Next stop Willoughby

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2025, 09:20:53 AM »
Gnarley. What can I say 'coomp'. You da man.
Rumor has it you da man.
May music greet you in the morning and sing you to sleep at night.
2025 is going to be interesting, eh?

In other diatonic news:

There is a new model on the market, Bushman sells it here in the US under the moniker “Game Changer “, I don’t expect that SmoJoe has tried it—neither have I.
https://bushmanmusic.com/shop/bushman-harmonicas/game-changer-harmonica/
No affiliation.
It has a button, but Management here has ruled that it is a diatonic beast.
Depending on your attention span, it may be easier or more difficult to play. I would, doubtless, retune it.
Money is tight right now, but eventually I’m sure I will have more to say.
https://forums.SlideMeister.com/index.php?topic=21823.0
« Last Edit: January 05, 2025, 09:42:45 AM by Gnarly He Man »

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2025, 09:35:04 AM »
https://youtu.be/e_cKy9ow0nE?si=g5OkXFiKn9row9UJ
Mystery man extolling the virtues of a Bushman harmonica.
Note the presence of Kaitlin Dibble at the two minute mark.
That should help solve the identity of the protagonist.

Offline Danny G

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2025, 01:20:12 PM »
Quote
These instruments are so very portable, every child deserves one.
I don't know a kid that has never owned a harmonica. I do know several parents who have wished that I never gave their kids harmonicas

Offline Age

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2025, 05:09:49 PM »
I seriously doubt that they work anything like in the video, but "Delta Frost" is, by far, the absolute coolest name ever given to a suck-harp!
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Offline smojoe

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2025, 06:48:11 PM »
I never DID know a kid who owned (or played) a harmonica.
First minute I started to get stomach pains.
When the father Sarducci dude cranked it up with the frost I was impressed.
I have tried one. It is ok. But haven't bought a diatonic in years. Maybe over a decade. Last paid $29.50. So that's a clue.
I have religiously used Hohner spl-20s since they first came out. Maybe in the early 70's ?
Who is Kaitlin Dibble?
My favorite name for a diatonic is Hot Metal.
I currently have a set of 14, of which 6 are smo-joe tuned.
I also have about 7 new in box. And 11-12 chromatics, with 3 being new.
Haven't touched them since 2019, :(

The 'they' that say

Offline brorat

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2025, 06:57:29 PM »

My favorite name for a diatonic is Hot Metal.
I currently have a set of 14, of which 6 are smo-joe tuned.
I also have about 7 new in box. And 11-12 chromatics, with 3 being new.
Haven't touched them since 2019, :(

The 'they' that say

So, Joe…are you trying to tell us you’re prepping for a fire sale?😂😂
“Just here to harp on chromatics!”

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2025, 08:52:51 PM »
When the father Sarducci dude cranked it up with the frost I was impressed.
That's Jason Ricci!
Quote
Who is Kaitlin Dibble?
He married her--this video is from eleven years ago.

Offline smojoe

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2025, 09:56:20 PM »
Brorat...I had considered going to spah and selling them for a song. BUT I don't know if Mama Cass (the live one) would be able to get by with me gone 4 1/2 days. Had just talked to George Miklas and he knows my problem. Just got in from hand feeding the 'outside animals'. Usually they change nightly. But recently it has been a family of racoons. Parents and 3 kits. Like our family used to be.

As for all the diatonics. I didn't mean to insuate that they were all hot metal. They are, in fact, 20 x spl-20s, and 1 x golden melody. And as for Jason, his disguise was so good. I didn't even recognize his voice. And I never met Kaitlin. Had considered driving up to NOLa and dropping in on him. But lately I don't feel like doing anything.

Back to those whom have never read my writings but by retuning and/or putting valves on a diatonic, you can open a different world and do tunes that heretofore had required 2 or even 3 diatonics to accomplish. I once did a number at spah with Mike Rubin (Have you met miss Jones) where I used 2 differently tuned and 1 straight tuned. Due to key idiosynchrosies it woud otherwise have required 4 harps.

Charley McCoy used to do Londonderry Aire (Oh, Danny Boy) with 2 harps, Whereas I used only one. He did the theme with a 'crossed' D, and then the bridge with a 'straight Richter' A.

smo-joe

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing, the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2025, 09:34:26 AM »
Blow three and draw two are the same note!
An important diatonic note is missing as a result, but you can bend the draw note on hole 3 to “fill in the blanks”.
Solo tuning (the tuning on the chromatic) manifests itself on holes 4-7, but 1-3 is tuned differently, omitting Fa and La. Fa is a bend on 2 and La is a bend on 3.
It will bug you (enough to want to play chrom!) not to have those notes, and that is where the difficulty of playing the diatonic comes in.
As others have shown, it IS possible to make good music on a diatonic, and mastering the draw bends on 2 and 3 take you a long way there.
I do notice, however, when the bent note on 3 is exposed—frankly it’s hard to achieve great tone with bent notes (and we haven’t even gotten to the extended notes you can squeak out--folks are calling these artificially created tones “overbends" but they can sound really lame).

But that is the goal—make it pretty.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2025, 11:52:22 AM by Gnarly He Man »

Offline Gnarly He Man

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Re: Relative difficulty of playing the diatonic harmonica
« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2025, 11:50:38 AM »
I am putting this here even tho it might belong under another topic.
https://youtu.be/cSRnVWI0B5M?si=JOjknW84-pFUKz41
I used Audacity to pitch shift a track I created using the Stem separation tool in Band in a Box--evidently the recording is "in the cracks".
And I demonstrated this discrepancy using a diatonic harmonica.
The tune is Last Dance with Mary Jane--G harmonica in 3rd position, you can teach a child to do this in minutes.
Ask their mother first  ;D