Author Topic: Chords in harmonica  (Read 764 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Gene Oh

  • PRESIDENT'S CLUB
  • Chrome-Minator
  • *
  • Posts: 644
  • Member
Chords in harmonica
« on: August 29, 2023, 07:28:31 PM »
https://youtu.be/roi9z4Dx2xU?si=HtmNuXIab3fm5_mn

Today I came across the above YouTube video in which the player used "chords(?)" - I don't know what I need to call this in harmonica music in English.
Anyhow, I like it very much. If possible, I want to learn (or emulate) this technique. What is your opinion?
Gene

Offline Danny G

  • Happiness is a New Harmonica
  • THE PARTY GUY
  • MonsterMeister
  • *
  • Posts: 5,709
  • Danny G
    • New Harmonica
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2023, 08:19:48 PM »
I think she is playing an Asian tuned tremolo

Offline Grizzly

  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,359
  • aka Tom
    • Transcriptions
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2023, 09:02:50 PM »
As long as it's solo tuned, it doesn't matter. All of what she's playing is notes available in the key in which the harmonica is built. There are suggestions of more complete chords (triads) that fool the ear. Major and minor thirds are combined with arpeggiated single notes to complete the illusion. Artisically and cleverly done.

Tom
working on my second 10,000!

Offline Age

  • A.J.Fedor
  • HELPER
  • Chrome-Tributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 463
  • A.J. Fedor ><((((º> (member since 9/1/22)
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2023, 11:55:41 PM »
 Yeah, I call it "tongue thumping." True, there are a couple actual chords in there but that's it; the rest are "assumed," or "perceived" to be the proper chords.
Retired Champion Thread Starter 😎

Offline John Broecker

  • (Time-traveller)
  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,673
  • Vintage 2K? Swan 1456 & JB
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2023, 03:38:29 AM »
Tongue thumping is also known as vamping,
in harmonica lingo. A chord, in music, is 3
or more notes played together.

If the player in the example is vamping, there
are very few actual chords (simultaneous playing
of three or more notes) available for use on a
solo system reed placement harmonica.

So, the performer uses various techniques to
give an impression of chords:

Vamping "oom-pa-pa" or "oom-pa"- the root
(lowest note) of the chord "oom", followed by
the 2nd & 3rd chord notes in a "diad", (two
notes played together):

   E E       E  E                   E      E
C G G,  C G  G, waltz; or C G, C G , etc., polka

Arpeggios ("broken chords"-playing the chord
melodically, one note at a time):

C E G, C E G, or the inversions E G C, E G C,
or G C E, etc.

Ghost notes (selected notes of a 3-note chord
are omitted, or notes not part of the traditional chord
are added) by the performer, omitted notes written
here in parenthesis (C), added non-chord notes are
written here as [d]:

f a (C)- on a key of C harp, the notes f-a draw are 
available, but the F chord's (C) blow note is exhale.
Exhale and inhale reeds can't be played together.

The exhale C note is not played as part of the f chord.
An E minor chord (E g b) is not playable, the E note is
an exhale, the g b notes are inhale.

d f a b- on a key of C harp, all 4 notes are playable
together inhale, but not as a d minor chord. The b note
may be added to the d minor chord, changing the chord
to b diminished chord, or d minor 6th chord. Those are
not always acceptable to the listener's ears, or to the
composer's intent.

Three-note chords available on a key of C solo system
slide chromatic, slide out:

C and C inversions;
d minor and d minor 6th (a 4-note chord);
b diminished

The key of C solo system harp doesn't have an available
G dominant or dom. 7th chord, the second most important
chords in the key of C.

Hans Bilbus was disturbed by Larry Adler's use of improper
chords while Larry was vamping on his Super Chromonica,
so Bilbus invented the Hohner Harmonetta, patented in 1947.

 
Best Regards, Stay Healthy

JB
« Last Edit: August 31, 2023, 02:42:14 AM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

Offline lflisboa

  • Chrome-Tributor
  • **
  • Posts: 230
  • Member
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2023, 11:10:18 AM »
I think the lady is playing a tremolo model. Here's some Joe Filisko's examples with a richter diatonic. You may check his channel where he explains about vamping, chording, octaves and splits too.

https://youtu.be/sW7yoIgBTJc?si=4BT5fEWKIDNP7yn_

https://youtu.be/6CLQh5ZKSLk?si=B7j6z0vLoY3mKN5O

https://youtu.be/cu5YHlF7_6E?si=xDm6t_cmhiagoRaG
« Last Edit: August 30, 2023, 11:12:19 AM by lflisboa »

Offline John Broecker

  • (Time-traveller)
  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,673
  • Vintage 2K? Swan 1456 & JB
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2023, 12:53:11 PM »
Actual chords are few on a solo system
slide chromatic.

Asian tremolos are factory-set in Richter
system. All tremolo harps, Asian & European,
are diatonic, Richter system reed placement.

A few manufacturers make 10-hole Richter
slide chromatics, the same reed placement
as a 10-hole blues harp.

The dominant 7th chord (G7 on a C harp)
is available as an inhale chord on C Richter
slide chromatic harps.

Hohner stopped making "The Chromonica",
Hohner "Slide Harp", and other 10-hole Richter
slide harps, circa 2018.

In the 2005 products catalog, Hering displayed
their "Vintage 40" and "Chromatic 40", both
Richter chromatics (?) with wood combs. It's
unknown if they still make these models.

In Seydel's 2014 catalog, the "Chromatic Deluxe
Blues" was listed. It's a 12-hole Richter system
slide chromatic, in the keys:

Low C
Low D
Low E
Low F
G
A
Bb

Another interesting Seydel chord slide harp
was listed, the Seydel "Chromatic Deluxe
Chor". It has the same reed placement as
the Hohner "Marine Band" 10-hole diatonic,
and Hohner "Chordomonica I" slide diatonic,
designed by Cham-Ber Huang.

Seydel will custom-make any reed placement
on their slide chromatics, for an extra fee.

Hohner stopped production of "Chordomonica I"
(10-hole) & "Chordomonica II" (12-hole, more
chords) in 1975.

Diatonic Richter slide harps offer more factory-
installed chords than the standard solo system
slide harps, but the Richter slide harps are not
fully chromatic.

With the player's bending & overblowing, the
Richter sliders may be fully chromatic.

Best Regards, Stay Healthy

JB
The Afuche Apache
« Last Edit: August 31, 2023, 02:53:02 AM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

Offline beads

  • Chrome-Meister
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,895
    • my youtube channel
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2023, 01:55:44 PM »
Hello Gene. The notes are arranged on a harmonica to make this possible. I made some videos about this years ago. They might help you, or they may not (I'm not a music teacher).






If you study some basic chord theory and know where the notes are on your harmonica, then you can visualize the chords yourself while you play.
Onze-Lieve-Vrouw van Troost Bid voor ons.

Offline Age

  • A.J.Fedor
  • HELPER
  • Chrome-Tributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 463
  • A.J. Fedor ><((((º> (member since 9/1/22)
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2023, 06:30:48 PM »
Yeah, I noticed the girl playing "treading lightly" on the ones that were not exactly chords. Just goes to show how good she really is, and "in tune" with the number she's playing. Most "thumpers" ignorantly assume the proper "chords" will automatically/magically fall into place as they chomp through a number, totally oblivious to all the clams, clinkers and farkles incorporated in the "chords" they think they're playing. I have little use for "thumpers" who make Chromatic players look bad; and unfortunately, there are lots of them.  >:(
« Last Edit: August 30, 2023, 06:33:21 PM by Age »
Retired Champion Thread Starter 😎

Offline J.R.

  • Chrome-Tributor
  • **
  • Posts: 137
  • Member
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2023, 07:52:45 PM »
The typical Ritcher or Blues harmonica has two accords in the First three holes. If it's a C harmonica, it has the Major C accord (blown) and the Major G accord (drawn). They are the most used accords in the Major C tonality.

Offline Gnarly He Man

  • AKA Gary
  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 15,275
  • Chroma means color
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2023, 09:17:53 PM »
One of the reasons I like raising draw 5 on a standard tuned harmonica (Country Tuning) is that you then have all three chords (if the harp was a C, you now have C D and G) as triads.

Offline beads

  • Chrome-Meister
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,895
    • my youtube channel
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2023, 08:28:33 PM »
One of the reasons I like raising draw 5 on a standard tuned harmonica (Country Tuning) is that you then have all three chords (if the harp was a C, you now have C D and G) as triads.
To get 3 chords I will usually use two harps. C and G harps provide C, D and two G chords. Two ways of playing G allows more options on when to switch harps and still sound musical. This is why double sided Echo harps are usually a 5th apart.
Onze-Lieve-Vrouw van Troost Bid voor ons.

Offline J.R.

  • Chrome-Tributor
  • **
  • Posts: 137
  • Member
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2023, 06:58:11 PM »
One of the reasons I like raising draw 5 on a standard tuned harmonica (Country Tuning) is that you then have all three chords (if the harp was a C, you now have C D and G) as triads.
To get 3 chords I will usually use two harps. C and G harps provide C, D and two G chords. Two ways of playing G allows more options on when to switch harps and still sound musical. This is why double sided Echo harps are usually a 5th apart.

Just like the Double Puck.

Offline John Broecker

  • (Time-traveller)
  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,673
  • Vintage 2K? Swan 1456 & JB
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2023, 07:25:54 AM »
Hello, Sliders.

Richter system harps: tremolos, 10-hole diatonics & 12-hole Richter
slide harps, have 7 available, factory-installed chords.

On a key of C Richter: On the following charts, exhale reeds are listed
with large Letters (C,E,G); & inhale reeds are listed with small letters (d,f,a,b):

KEY OF C, RICHTER SYSTEM DIATONIC ("BLUES HARPS")

Hole:    1     2      3     4     5     6     7     8     9     10
        ||C d |E g |G b |C d |E f |G a |b C |d E |f G |a C ||

ASIAN REED PLACEMENTS, RICHTER SYSTEM

The Asian System Richter tremolos generally have 21-, 23- and 24-hole reed
chamber choices as standard, and may have other reed chamber amounts.
 
Tremolo harps have 2 reeds in each chamber, of the same pitch, one slightly
de-tuned. This allows a "tremolo" effect when the 2 reeds are played together.

KEY OF C, RICHTER TREMOLOS, ASIAN SYSTEM
(SUZUKI ST-24, 1999 Catalog):

Hole:|| 1 | 2  | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 |10 |11 |12 |13 |14 |15 |16 |17 |18 |19 |20|21 |22|23|24 ||
        ||C  | d  |E  |f  |G  | a | C | b | E | d  | G | f   | C  | a  | E | b  | G | d  | C  | f  | E | a | G | b ||

The 21-hole tremolo starts on the hole 2, "d" reed on the above chart, ending
on the reed "a", of hole 22; and the 23-hole model starts on hole 3, E, ending on
hole #24, "b" reed.


SEYDEL CHROMATIC DELUXE RICHTER BLUES, KEY OF C
(Single reed per note Richter system chromatic, sold in keys of C, D, E, F, G, A, Bb, B):

Hole:  ||  1  |  2  |  3  |  4  | 5  |  6  |  7  |  8  |  9 | 10 | 11 | 12  ||
          ||C d |E g |G b |C d |E f |G a |b C |d E |f G |a C |b E |d G ||

AVAILABLE CHORDS ON RICHTER SYSTEM HARPS
You'll find these chords, by using the above Richter chart that fits the description
of your harp.

C (C-E-G) and inversions (E-G-C, G-C-E); exhale on the C harp.

g (g-b-d) inhale;

g7 (g-b-d-f) inhale;

g9 (g-b-d-f-a) inhale;

b diminished (b-d-f) inhale;

b dim.7 (b-d-f-a) inhale;

d minor (d-f-a) inhale.

Best Regards, Stay Healthy

JB
« Last Edit: November 29, 2023, 05:29:25 PM by John Broecker »
"Elton John is right up there with David Bowie."--Rick Harrison, "Pawn Stars" TV show, USA. Rick is discussing collectibles.

Offline Gnarly He Man

  • AKA Gary
  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 15,275
  • Chroma means color
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #14 on: November 29, 2023, 08:42:03 AM »
It is possible to retune a standard chromatic harmonica to play chords and melody. One common example is the Chordomonica. There are other possible tunings that produce other chords.
Here’s the facts from our old friend Pat Missin.
https://www.patmissin.com/ffaq/q31.html

Offline Gnarly He Man

  • AKA Gary
  • HELPER
  • MonsterMeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 15,275
  • Chroma means color
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #15 on: November 29, 2023, 08:44:52 AM »
Another example from the remarkable Rory Hoffman.
https://youtu.be/RBqYHasjKdw?si=Vgg_S_908ULKJW12

Offline Age

  • A.J.Fedor
  • HELPER
  • Chrome-Tributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 463
  • A.J. Fedor ><((((º> (member since 9/1/22)
Re: Chords in harmonica
« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2023, 12:33:43 PM »
That Rory is just flat-out phenomenal.  He was actually on SlideMeister back in the old Yahoo days.
Retired Champion Thread Starter 😎